This is a response blog post to what Michel Fortin and Salty Droid* had to say about our beloved “gurus” in the IM industry.
If you are a customer, affiliate, or seller in the IM industry of any relation THESE BLOG POSTS ARE MANDATORY READING!
Over the last 6 months the “shit” has finally been hitting the fan. While I don’t think anyone can stop the train yet, it appears efforts are underway.
What I Saw When They Let Me Backstage
Not long ago I wanted nothing more than to be part of the “big boys club” and I worked my ass off trying to get there. I copied their styles, I bought their products, I made them tens of thousands of dollars as an affiliate.
Before long I started getting “in” and the invites started coming in. One seminar here, one mastermind meeting there, and now I’m starting to get some recognition… finally.
While attending on of there private and yes “secret” mastermind meetings I got my chance to stand up in front of the room.
The way it works is everyone shares a bit of intel about what’s working for them and what their sticking points are, then everyone chips in some advice to get through the sticking points.
The sticking point for me was “How do I help more of my customers take action and get results from my courses?”
This is a real pain point for me because it kills me to know that 80% of the people buying my products will never use them, I HATE THAT. So I asked all the guys who I looked up too how to fix it.
Their reply was “Oh, you’ll get over that”
WTF!!!
That’s the moment when I knew I was in the wrong room with the wrong people.
I remember ranting to my wife about it later that night in the hotel room and saying “GET OVER IT! What if I don’t want to get over it!”
These days I focus much more on giving real value, both upfront and after the sale. We honor every refund, we go out of our way to help customers that ask us for help, and we only promote/teach things we would sell to our own mothers.
I do want to point out that I am not speaking about every seller in the IM industry. The bad eggs are outnumbered, but their tricks have been so effective that their sheer size is intimidating. (Intimidating is not even a strong enough word)
If you could imagine an elephant pissing in a blow up kiddie pool, you would understand what they are doing to our industry and at what speed.
The Cure is Consumer Education
Michel said it…
We need to educate the market about what to lookout for, because the current philosophy of “subscribe to anyone who makes a lot of money” is just not working. It’s hurting them, it’s hurting us, and it’s hurting the industry.
As always you should decide for yourself and use your own head when making decisions, but these are the rules I use when I’m personally buying advice/training/tools for my business.
Does the person/course/tool pertain to your current business model?
By business model I mean how you acquire revenue. For example an affiliate marketer who solely build blogs optimized for the search engines has no business buying something about “product launch methods.”
Just like someone trying to sell an ebook doesn’t need to be buying a course about getting local SEO clients.
You wouldn’t buy shampoo to wash your car so don’t buy the wrong courses/tools/services in your IM business either!
Can YOUR BUSINESS afford the product?
If you are buying products and courses with your house money you are hurting yourself and possibly your family as well. It’s different if you have set aside money or raised money to start a business and using those funds as start-up funds.
However, there are far too many stories of “I’ve bought thousands of dollars worth of products and nothing has worked.”
If you are not making money then you should not be spending money… That’s the exact opposite direction you want to be heading. Although, once you do start making some money you should invest it immediately to grow your business with.
Refer to rule #1 at that point
Does the seller care more about your success or their own?
There is an easy test to see if the guy you are considering buying training from cares more about you or himself. Just look at the way he interacts with you.
- Is every email he/she sends out a sales pitch for another product?
- Do they have a phone number you can call for help (and someone actually picks up)?
- Do they put out educational content on a regular basis other than when it’s a follow-up to their product launch?
If they are always selling you something, provide very limited assistance, and rarely put our educational material than maybe you should find someone else that does. There’s plenty of them out there and I’ll even name a few Michel Fortin, Lynn Terry, Myself, Travis Sago, Michelle MacPhearson and many more.
If treated correctly, instead of pillaged, the IM industry could change the world. We just have a few bad eggs getting 90% of the attention.
Follow those rules, do your research, stop drinking the kool-aid, and together we can change the tide.
* I did not link off to Salty Droid’s blog post about the legality of Frank Kern’s “Internet Marketing Syndicate” because I don’t approve or condone the viciousness he and his commentators often use. However, it should be read.



{ 9 comments… read them below or add one }
Well said man. I wonder how this will all play out.
If you wake up every morning asking yourself “How can I make someone’s life or business better” and truly mean that – you’ll win in the end. Might take a bit longer than getting in bed with the “gurus” but you’ll go to bed at night knowing you’re doing what’s right.
Thanks for posting this brother.
Great response bro. I read Michels post last night and it really struck a chord.
But to be honest, I don’t really care about underground syndicates and the Old Boys’ Clubs.
What matters to me when I consider a purchase is whether or not a product can help my business TODAY.
In fact, I’ve taken a huge information diet and unsubscribed from all but 3 or 4 email lists that are useful to me – today. Cutting off the “guru” firehose means I can concentrate on plan A and not be distracted.
No doubt, a lot of the big launches have been stellar and the products might well be great for those who use them. But there needs to be some kind of responsibility here – we must all be more conscious of what we buy. Not just to save money but to save our mindspace.
As marketers too, we are responsible for our customers who buy from us. Sure we can’t control if somebody doesn’t follow through with action but like you, I want to see people succeed when they buy from me.
I reckon this post should get some heady responses too. Roll on.
Great post man, use of your product is very important… I think one thing everyone has got to understand that if they don’t use and benefit from your product they are probably a one stop shop customer too… If you can get them to use your product and benefit they will be a customer for life and a raving fan/testimonial. I think the bigger your success online the more people you are helping… that’s how I am going to weigh my terms of success and not “how much money” i’ve persuaded people to give me for something they’ll never use.
Great post bro… keep giving value!
David
Hey Justin, good post.
I am actually surprised you even touched this one at all, since a couple of your buds are on Droid’s Bad Guy list.
Michael.
Hi Justin,
It’s been some time since i have been in touch with you guys, but i’m happy to see you’re still going for the jugular, finding the ‘core’ truths and not being afraid to share them with the world.
These days, I find it really easy to spot the ‘quality’ people & their products , and vice-versa, the crap, rehashed, overhyped bullshit that is being peddled en-masse by self proclaimed ‘guru’s’ .
I really do believe the IM world is slowly, but surely, cleaning up it’s act, and we’re actually starting to see that a long term strategy, whilst not immediately beneficial, is infinitely more profitable, and valued.
Comparing this to half arsed crap where it appears we’re paying more for the sales copy then the actual product!
Sorry to hear you’re cutting back on the site fling site, but i understand exactly where you’re coming from with that. I recently just spotted one of your blog updates on LinkedIn, and was surprised to see you’re still going hard at it.
All the best,
Anthony.
Very good that you are calling out to check who is who!
I have been following Michelle Fortin for quite some time now and I was so happy for his take on forced continuity.
I am very glad that you are calling the bluffs out there – many of them based on NLP techniques.
What more can we do?
Best wishes
Rolf
Education education education… and those that can’t educate should be sharing the info from those who can
That’s what I like about you Justin, you really care and that is nearly impossible to find in the industry these days!
Justin,
This post really hit home with me because I see so many people spending money but never taking action on anything. They jump from product to product without ever taking the time to implement any of the ideas to see if they work. It bothers me, too, when people buy products they never use. It’s disheartening at times.
I like to provide value in my emails rather than sending pitch after pitch to my readers. While I feel there’s nothing wrong with promoting a product I believe in, I also believe that I should provide value as well. Products should provide value as well. I like how you provide good, usable information in your blog posts while promoting your products at the same time. Thanks for a useful blog – so many are not!